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本帖最后由 klwo2 于 2019-11-4 23:18 编辑
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童哥说单词:牛津词源全解:
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9 x! {6 ]8 Z9 e8 I, m, Airony
+ j9 S; Y: b& a+ x: z5 t4 v来自拉丁语ironia, 来自希腊语eiron, 装糊涂,假装无知,可能来自eirein, 说,言语,词源同verb, verbal。主要用于古希腊哲学家苏格拉底的哲学思想和辩证手法,苏格拉底在与人们辩论的时候,常常先承认自己的无知和对方观点的正确,然后通过举例来引起对方的思考并最终让对方承认自己的错误。
2 L/ C( z' S f" ]3 J- k按说童哥说单词不是什么特别入流的材料,可是居然比很多英汉词典讲得还正确哪!远东英汉:0 ?8 y9 l# k; q
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1 j3 b, r1 V( k1 ^6 w; d5 Q苏格拉底在远东英汉笔下怎么变成算命的啦!再看英汉辞海:2 f8 F8 W/ j5 @( g' B* l$ u
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" i& s: z* r2 O! E怎么这么心机婊啊!
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. v2 b! r& `+ H; O" M( g英汉辞海的蓝本是W3,我们一起看看Webster's Third New International Dictionary:
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a. : feigned ignorance designed to confound or provoke an antagonist : dissimulation — compare socratic irony
3 u+ Y9 \+ {3 Y: {7 R! t1 U9 ?呵呵!原来confound 和provoke 都是多义词,这可坑坏了远东英汉、英汉辞海的译者,找不准意思啊!
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9 L1 ]0 O7 d5 B' ^1 I3 Y: `% x2 t/ bVocabulary.com 2 \- y8 u2 n+ b1 e o# N6 B
Socratic irony
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/ l. e4 _+ V2 `4 J2 D6 d8 ~( h* JSocratic irony is when you pretend to be ignorant to expose the ignorance or inconsistency of someone else.' a8 {: b$ c3 Y5 I+ m
Socrates was a famous Greek philosopher known for his probing questions. Irony is when a statement means the opposite of its literal meaning. That should help you remember that Socratic irony is a technique where the questioner admits (falsely) to not knowing something as a way of tricking the other person into revealing his own lack of knowledge or a flaw in his logic. Socratic irony involves pretending to be ignorant to show someone else is ignorant: thus, the irony.
8 ~2 `6 S6 G( o% M; cVocabulary.com 帮了我们一把,为什么「Socratic irony」要说irony呢,因为本来是苏格拉底自己假装不知道,结果反衬出是别人不知道。反着来,所以说irony
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Penguin English Dictionary:- v! f* I9 @" V. [% N- Y* ]
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a pretence of ignorance in order to entice others into exposing their pretensions of knowledge through skilful questioning. 5 n ]+ Q% \8 f" Y1 M1 I' k/ t
企鹅的遣词也很厉害哟,对比鲜明。
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+ k9 P/ v% y$ G0 I别的词典,尤其是英汉词典,就没有什么亮点啦。英汉大词典:$ h* p+ N. w2 E) F" j* I, h8 |
6 L6 Y5 q5 p& f, fSocratic irony7 n: G7 v- j- t. F$ ^- k% _
苏格拉底式的佯作无知 ; N6 @/ x$ c; N% X6 j
然后呢?他佯作无知然后怎么啦?怎么irony了?读者一头雾水。. {$ O# E: ~1 e/ Z
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新牛津双解:
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' u; ]+ a4 a: u( K9 X' Da pose of ignorance assumed in order to entice others into making statements that can then be challenged. W, z2 t- b, y$ m
苏格拉底式的佯作无知(为诱使他人发表随即可以予以批驳的言论)。
$ |% m% H0 @3 B+ v请问新牛津译者,原文里哪有「随即可以批驳」这么吓人啊,人家说的明明是challenge啊!苏格拉底又不搞引蛇出洞的阳谋!
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( `5 _- n6 f+ z* r蓝登书屋韦氏英汉大学词典:! q' P0 o. P* o" U* w
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5 F/ z0 ]/ }% h( Q7 W: {9 y( u3 o说真的,这个还行,只是仍然差临门一脚:苏格拉底佯作无知到底图个啥?/ d6 |3 x6 Y. s
4 A3 h+ Z" T. `三民英汉大词典:. `: p% g6 e2 G+ ^" @! j
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: _% A4 |% L: R6 ~3 D+ b也是个没讲清楚的玩意- E3 R; G% x2 j# A/ e F! b# ~: z
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译文版牛津英汉双解词典:
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& T3 |2 d1 [2 T' `* t8 o/ c. I: i: l这位干脆把原文里头的challenge吃了,至于「反诘法」……呃……不知道该说什么好,反正我估计读者是没明白的……
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